xAP Talk Transcript 2007 03 06
06/03/2007 14:59:26 ‹Ian B› How are things your end?
06/03/2007 14:59:32 ‹KevinH› sorry .. back - how's things ?
06/03/2007 14:59:53 ‹Ian B› good thanks
06/03/2007 15:00:01 ‹KevinH› Fine at this end but havinga few embedded projects out there is adding to my support issues
06/03/2007 15:00:07 ‹Ian B› deep in writing socket TCP code for my little box of tricks
06/03/2007 15:00:13 ‹Ian B› slow going but I am getting ther
06/03/2007 15:00:14 ‹Ian B› e
06/03/2007 15:00:34 ‹Ian B› Support is the down side I think
06/03/2007 15:00:37 ‹KevinH› I did a HomeVision project and it seems to behave differently once it leaves Yorkshire
06/03/2007 15:00:45 ‹Ian B› much more fun developing ;)
06/03/2007 15:01:01 ‹Ian B› What was that then?
06/03/2007 15:01:01 ‹KevinH› Did you use your Maxbotix stuff ?
06/03/2007 15:01:13 ‹Ian B› Not yet on the Max stuff
06/03/2007 15:01:21 ‹Ian B› it's on the to do list
06/03/2007 15:01:29 ‹KevinH› A long todo I suspect
06/03/2007 15:01:38 ‹Ian B› yup, guess so
06/03/2007 15:01:42 * James joins My room
06/03/2007 15:02:06 ‹James› evening all
06/03/2007 15:02:09 ‹KevinH› Wasn't it all change at work for you too I ?
06/03/2007 15:02:10 ‹KevinH› Hi J
06/03/2007 15:02:21 ‹Ian B› One day I would like to write an embedded interface to HV using xAP
06/03/2007 15:02:34 ‹Ian B› Hi K
06/03/2007 15:02:46 ‹Ian B› or J even - oops
06/03/2007 15:03:09 ‹KevinH› I have an embedded interface to Hv Ian
06/03/2007 15:03:19 ‹KevinH› All HV I/O as BSC
06/03/2007 15:03:51 ‹KevinH› and can simulate BSC level or binary devices within HV
06/03/2007 15:03:54 ‹Ian B› ahhh, excellent
06/03/2007 15:04:12 ‹Ian B› what about the other stuff particularly variables and timers?
06/03/2007 15:04:19 ‹KevinH› it's the one that goes wrong outside of Yorkshire currently
06/03/2007 15:04:38 ‹Ian B› Damn, i'll have to move
06/03/2007 15:04:54 ‹Ian B› Is it Ethernet ?
06/03/2007 15:04:54 ‹KevinH› Variables are BSC level devices, Flags are binary and timers I ahven't done much with yet
06/03/2007 15:04:58 ‹KevinH› Yes
06/03/2007 15:05:08 ‹Ian B› cool
06/03/2007 15:05:32 ‹KevinH› You can trigger macros from xAP and so I giess for timers you just want the same ?
06/03/2007 15:05:50 ‹Ian B› I plan to use this then to interface between my touch screen and HV. I can then do lots of wicked things like say how long the herating has to run etc.
06/03/2007 15:06:06 ‹Ian B› timers is an interrogation thing
06/03/2007 15:06:15 ‹Ian B› how long has x got to run etc.
06/03/2007 15:07:24 ‹KevinH› Hmm - I dont think HV knows how longa timer has to run does it ?
06/03/2007 15:07:43 ‹KevinH› or at least cna it report it back to a macro as a variable ?
06/03/2007 15:07:50 ‹KevinH› If so I could probably do that
06/03/2007 15:07:51 ‹Ian B› haven't looked into it but I don't see why not
06/03/2007 15:08:07 ‹Ian B› you load the timer value into a variable and then work it out from there
06/03/2007 15:08:19 ‹Ian B› I did play a few years ago but was defeated
06/03/2007 15:08:28 ‹KevinH› .. and I can load it into a var ?
06/03/2007 15:08:38 ‹KevinH› which is only 8 bit ?
06/03/2007 15:08:40 ‹Ian B› just using the HV software and a PC of course
06/03/2007 15:09:19 ‹Ian B› you have to use high and low I think - hence my confusion at the time
06/03/2007 15:09:28 ‹Ian B› I am sure Craig will point us if we ask
06/03/2007 15:09:51 ‹Ian B› there is something in the help file IIRC
06/03/2007 15:10:01 ‹KevinH› .. this is an important need - to know how long a timer still has to run ??
06/03/2007 15:10:30 ‹Ian B› in the case of the heating and the missus yes ;-)
06/03/2007 15:10:47 ‹Ian B› also applicable for the irrigation too
06/03/2007 15:10:56 ‹Ian B› in the summer anyway
06/03/2007 15:13:05 ‹KevinH› cmd #6 type = put timer value into 4 variables
06/03/2007 15:13:15 ‹KevinH› :-)
06/03/2007 15:13:30 ‹Ian B› that'll be the one
06/03/2007 15:13:35 ‹KevinH› assuming it decrements in realtime
06/03/2007 15:14:32 ‹Ian B› I was trying at the time to add an hour to the current value by way of a boost. It was the latter bit I could not work out at the time
06/03/2007 15:14:44 ‹Ian B› I assume it does the realtime bit
06/03/2007 15:14:53 ‹KevinH› you can change it as well - not sure if you can do thsi whilst timer is running though.....
06/03/2007 15:14:57 ‹KevinH› Cmd # 06 (type =) = Put Timer Value Into 4 Variables
06/03/2007 15:15:11 ‹KevinH› Cmd # 07 (type =) = Set Timer To Value Of 4 Variables
06/03/2007 15:16:25 ‹Ian B› For what I plan to do I would not have any problem with stopping the timer
06/03/2007 15:16:33 ‹Ian B› which is handy ;-)
06/03/2007 15:17:21 ‹KevinH› I dont use timers a lot really... but from a xAP perspective being able to delay a bsc.cmd might be useful
06/03/2007 15:17:46 ‹KevinH› most of my times events are scheduled or periodic
06/03/2007 15:18:13 ‹KevinH› So whats the current project Ian ?
06/03/2007 15:18:28 ‹Ian B› How do you interface to your HV embedded thingy? I mean from a PC type perspective. Is there an app?
06/03/2007 15:18:48 ‹Ian B› I am still on my touch screen controller
06/03/2007 15:19:07 ‹KevinH› The embedded controller has a serial linkage to HV and all the rest is xAP
06/03/2007 15:19:18 ‹Ian B› It has TCP/IP and a serial port too
06/03/2007 15:19:28 ‹Ian B› most stuff is Ethernet though
06/03/2007 15:19:53 ‹KevinH› actually the samecontroller will drive C-Bus if you add the C-Bus module... so HV then has full C-Bus control
06/03/2007 15:20:11 ‹Ian B› I was thinking of what sends and receives the xAP messages? I guess there is desktop etc. that fullfill this
06/03/2007 15:20:17 ‹KevinH› It has a web interface and ftp server too - although I haven;t coded up web pages yet
06/03/2007 15:20:28 ‹Ian B› Sadly I have no Cbus :-(
06/03/2007 15:21:04 ‹KevinH› Yes - if you do want a PC involved then you need a xAP capable application - HomeSeer, Desktop, Floorplan etc etc
06/03/2007 15:21:28 ‹Ian B› I am coding a serial config tool, a telnet one and html when I work out how to do the latter
06/03/2007 15:22:19 ‹KevinH› Or if it is (at the moment) fairly basic interaction then the opnode products provide a xAp driven event manager or you could use BSC Mapper or the (as yet not released) xAP embedded BSC mapper
06/03/2007 15:23:25 ‹KevinH› The opnode embedded xAP controller I use quite a bit as I am beta testing it.... it also adds 1 wire devices of course...
06/03/2007 15:23:41 ‹KevinH› opnode is Ethernet too
06/03/2007 15:23:50 ‹Ian B› coooool
06/03/2007 15:23:53 ‹KevinH› with embedded web control and status pages
06/03/2007 15:24:09 ‹Ian B› very nice and I can see where your workload is coming from
06/03/2007 15:24:46 ‹KevinH› ... and can redirect a xAP incoming 'event' to an xPL or 1-wire action - or indeed any combination of the three
06/03/2007 15:25:58 ‹KevinH› The opnode project is one Daniel (an independent commercial developer) is releasing
06/03/2007 15:26:12 ‹Ian B› ahhh, ok
06/03/2007 15:26:26 ‹KevinH› www.opnode.org
06/03/2007 15:27:28 * Edward joins My room
06/03/2007 15:27:38 ‹KevinH› Hi E...
06/03/2007 15:27:44 ‹Edward› Hi all
06/03/2007 15:28:45 ‹KevinH› I got a couple of Viewer things to report - I'll do that via email i think...
06/03/2007 15:29:26 ‹Edward› bugs or feature requests? (!)
06/03/2007 15:29:44 ‹KevinH› former... is that good news or bad ?
06/03/2007 15:30:17 ‹James› back
06/03/2007 15:30:20 ‹James› hi E
06/03/2007 15:30:36 ‹James› I've only found 1 bug :-(
06/03/2007 15:30:44 ‹Edward› bugs more likely to receive attention!
06/03/2007 15:30:55 ‹Edward› ah, you too
06/03/2007 15:31:01 ‹James› even silly and really minor ones?
06/03/2007 15:31:14 ‹Edward› silly - huh!
06/03/2007 15:31:24 ‹KevinH› Can you try saving a set of messages from a particular device - does it work ???
06/03/2007 15:31:26 ‹James› the bug is silly not viewer ;-)
06/03/2007 15:33:02 ‹James› K, I can save for a particular devce
06/03/2007 15:33:14 ‹KevinH› hmmm interesting...
06/03/2007 15:33:20 ‹Edward› hmm - er, not actually tested any of the save/load stuff
06/03/2007 15:33:50 ‹James› I used the second save option, the Save all visible xAP events for the selected device
06/03/2007 15:34:45 ‹Edward› (I wonder what an invisible xAP event is)
06/03/2007 15:34:59 ‹Edward› (or a xAP 'event' for that matter)
06/03/2007 15:35:04 ‹James› I may of just found an invisible xAP event. and another bug!
06/03/2007 15:35:26 ‹James› If you clear all messages. then click pause
06/03/2007 15:35:54 ‹James› no new messages appear, which is correct. but the device tree rebuilds itself
06/03/2007 15:36:49 ‹Edward› Yes, that's right - pause now just stops putting messages in the list view, but the viewer is still listening
06/03/2007 15:37:29 ‹James› but if you are working from a saved message set. It'll be annoying for the tree to fill up with devices
06/03/2007 15:37:34 ‹Edward› and so the tree continues to update - make more sense to me that way
06/03/2007 15:38:16 ‹Edward› hmmm - as I said, I'd not really considered the load/save stuff - never used it
06/03/2007 15:38:27 ‹KevinH› Message history save failed: Type 'KCS.xAP.Framework.Transport.xAPInvalidMessageEventArgs' in Assembly 'xAPTransport, version=2.0.2614.3436, Culture=neutral, PublicKeyToken=null' is not marked as serializable
06/03/2007 15:38:26 ‹Edward› what do you use it for?
06/03/2007 15:38:45 ‹KevinH› handtyped so may have typos
06/03/2007 15:38:53 ‹James› It's really quite useful when dealing with a message dump from another user when trying to debug things
06/03/2007 15:39:30 ‹James› especialy when you have interactions between multiple devices. like asterisk<>switchboard<>outlook
06/03/2007 15:39:30 ‹KevinH› also does number of saved messages persist for you ?
06/03/2007 15:40:03 ‹KevinH› I hope I'm still using your latest version cos I know you addressed things here
06/03/2007 15:40:22 ‹James› no, it doesn't it resets to 500 on launch
06/03/2007 15:42:18 ‹Edward› hmm, thought I'd fixed that one
06/03/2007 15:42:23 ‹KevinH› The interaction between two devices is a really fun aspect now The new Viewer seems to get thinsg in teh right order though which is a great help ;-)
06/03/2007 15:42:24 ‹Edward› OK - it's on the list
06/03/2007 15:42:42 ‹KevinH› Sorry taht should be :-D
06/03/2007 15:42:56 ‹Edward› Was the target filtering of any use?
06/03/2007 15:43:36 ‹KevinH› Yes indeed .. it has helped a lot although think I 'may have some wildcard issues
06/03/2007 15:44:11 ‹Edward› Not suprised that bit was very fiddly
06/03/2007 15:44:54 ‹KevinH› Im guessing Class is fiddly too - how difficult is it to redirect a 'scripted filter' to teh display window ?
06/03/2007 15:45:24 ‹KevinH› or a second window
06/03/2007 15:45:37 ‹KevinH› is that awkward too ?
06/03/2007 15:45:45 ‹Edward› 'scripted filter'? - give me an example
06/03/2007 15:46:36 ‹KevinH› In teh same way that I can edit custom columns provide something that selects or drops certain messages and at teh end of my 'filter' either drop it or display it
06/03/2007 15:46:59 ‹KevinH› so offload the filtering to a script
06/03/2007 15:47:28 ‹KevinH› the message is either passed for display or dropped
06/03/2007 15:48:01 ‹KevinH› (preferably to a second tab but anything would be good)
06/03/2007 15:48:45 ‹KevinH› I was just thinking that thsi avoided having to creat a filter screen with lots of AND OR NOT relationswhich would be tedious
06/03/2007 15:50:16 ‹Edward› So this is filtering based on more than just source or target address, yes?
06/03/2007 15:51:00 ‹KevinH› yes ..I would like to eb able to accept absed on Class inparticular
06/03/2007 15:51:17 ‹KevinH› BTW anyone know about this (5 lines up from bottom ) ???
06/03/2007 15:51:19 ‹KevinH› http://www.irtrans.de/en/main.php
06/03/2007 15:51:40 ‹KevinH› so I can just see BSC for example
06/03/2007 15:53:34 ‹Edward› Yup with you
06/03/2007 15:53:48 ‹Edward› irtrans - it's freaky when that happens
06/03/2007 15:54:11 ‹KevinH› You could call a 'passthrough' sub that was editable that returned the messages to display.. and allow users to add extra conditions..
06/03/2007 15:54:11 ‹Edward› and "IRTrans Ethernet Module" - is >just< what I've been looking for!
06/03/2007 15:54:30 ‹KevinH› It is amazing these things just turn up out of teh blue (IRTRans)
06/03/2007 15:54:50 ‹James› it is isn't it
06/03/2007 15:54:53 ‹KevinH› its relatively expensive
06/03/2007 15:55:32 ‹KevinH› I am not sure if the 'server' they refer to is a software PC app or embedded in their devices
06/03/2007 15:57:11 ‹Edward› I'll add the filters to the wishlist - right now I'm focussed on getting a .Net vesion of X10 out for testing and then to get an xFx release together
06/03/2007 15:57:30 ‹KevinH› NP - I'm keen on teh X10 too ;-)
06/03/2007 15:57:35 ‹James› me too!
06/03/2007 15:58:10 ‹KevinH› Opnodes little 1-wire is turning into an interesting little xAP event manager too...
06/03/2007 15:58:14 ‹James› is there any chance of the counter on a x10 input? The rocker on my mini timer are driving me nuts!
06/03/2007 15:58:20 ‹KevinH› all quite fun
06/03/2007 15:59:11 ‹KevinH› Sorry - gotta go for 30 misn or so - back later
06/03/2007 16:00:49 ‹Edward› X10: right now I just want to get a version out that works with the .Net serial driver to see if it fixes the periodic lockup problems, so no new features
06/03/2007 16:01:02 ‹James› ok, np
06/03/2007 16:02:01 ‹James› well i'd be a bad tester then, it's not locked up on me
06/03/2007 16:08:24 ‹Edward› no more frequently that once every few days, apparently - I've not seen it either
06/03/2007 16:09:00 ‹Edward› Could be a memory 'leak'
06/03/2007 16:10:33 ‹James› it's much easier whn you can see the issue happen though. fixing bug you never simple is nearly impossible
06/03/2007 16:11:10 ‹James› simple=see ? odd typo that!